How safe are your bodyarmour?

ACT

Having read the whole of the thread can I take the opportunity to thank you all.

As I've said I really do require information on what is most relevant to the job in hand.

Manchester has a reputation for gun crime, for the most part it is shorts that are used or sawn off shotguns, though on a few notable occasions longs have been used, so as I see it my requirement will be for level III protection. Does anyone have any information on how armour will stand up to impact from- sawn off shot gun, two handed axe (fireman lumberjack type) and my big concern is a full on impact from a sledge hammer.

Also can anyone advise on helmets and other body protection, arm, leg guards eye, hand protection etc.

Yes it's best to go home at the end of the day(night) with the same bits and pieces that we started with.

Once again CHEERS

ACT

ACT

Cheers mate,

I'm in the UK but my requirement is not for covert armour, so bulk and weight are not my main concerns. Like you say you pay for what you get and as I want to keep my insides inside then the cost has to be worth it.

Thanks for the advice and the links.

Stay safe mate.

ACT

kungfu_mattyb

Axe? sledge hammer? Have no idea mate. Manchesters not that bad is it?

But with the way the UK is heading you need to look at the Holy trinity of crime. Guns, Knifes and Drugs(needles). Body armour that can give you protection from all three is a must along with some kevlar gloves. It should be the right style ,weight and give the protection for the job at hand.

Overt vests with plates for both CP and Door work in the UK only single you out as a target. (You or the VIP).

However the Holy trinity for the sandpits of 7.62, Rpg and Ied is a topic I know jack about.
What types do the guys where? Do they work? Do they trust them?

Keep safe.

Hawk

If you need helmets and tactical equipment the guy you should talk to is Paul at SOLO international
SOLO International :: For Authentic Tactical Gear, Tactical Clothing, Weapons Accessories, Special Forces Supplies, Tactical Hardware, Medical Field Equipment & More...

He has helped me many times, say hello from Hawk (Håkan) in Sweden.
Regards,

hawk

Samson

another point i forgot , the individual or CPO who has decided to wear bodyarmour for various reasons depending on the threat level and understanding the CPO in the UK cannot carry firearms so a bullet proof vest is another piece of personal protection (ACT i uderstood why you want yours) but people if you decide you need to wear one take a few points into consideration ,i give you a scenario.... you have decided to wear abullet proof covert plated vest under your shirt while wearing a suit, you have a very busy business client you are protecting, you have his weekly timetable, but suddenly he has got a phone call and needs to either fly out, go to a foreign Embassy.Consulate and now! , your vest is going to set the alams off ona metal detector and potentialy make a scene, oops dont you look like a idiot,
All im realy saying know your client, they are all different and behave,act and have different routines and scheduals, pack & be prepared to sudden change in your clients movements or timetable.In the private sector your client decides what he/she wants and even though a sudden change to the timebale make affect the level of security at that time, in the end of the day and in the real world you as a CPO will give your client security advice,but your client is the boss paying the bills and has the final decision.

(finaly you must make the choice yourself that if you have a client who does not take any of your advice and its going to affect his protection to a dangerous level .so much so you decide not to take the job.)

mts

Graet points all.

Samson, as usual you're spot on.

A vest must be able to protect but not at the cost of preventing you moving.

Guys, kitting yourselves out like robocop to work doors or even CP is not the way to go about it. You need to be able to react to a situation and move.

m

Dirk

Be carefull with vest called second chance, they get selled very cheap but they didn´t have any guarantee anymore. The german police exchanged 28000 of this vests since 2005 because a US police officer got killed in a gunfight, after they investigated why the vest didn´t saved his live they found out that the material of these vest geeting week very fast. Here in germany they sell the second chance vests for 60-100 euro. At least they help a bit in a knife fight :-)

I found a link :-) Its in german but you can see a picture of the vest and the price:
http://www.yatego.com/springerstiefe...weste-s-m-l-xl

ACT

Lots of good advice, keep it coming guys.

I think Samson has sussed out what my role is, I neither do the doors or CP with a principal as such, I'm never in the public eye.

Thanks Dirk for the heads up on the Second Chance gear, that sort of gen is invaluable.

Yes MTS I agree with you on the Robocop look, also I think (only my opinion) that in some cases the wearing of armour can lead to unnecessary injury, people start to think they are invincible and therefore make reckless decisions.

More of the same please guys.

Stay safe!

ACT

Marian

Yep, used vests although can be still OK, are no good as you don't know how the previous owner was taking care of it, right/bad treatment can extend or seriously shorten life of body armor.
You can find good info on this in Galls, they also have a good selection of vests, from their page:
NIJ standards
Galls
Buyer's guide
Ballistic Vests, Introduction - Galls

By the way there is new [after .04 and .05 interin] NIJ standard:

Ballistic Resistance of Body Armor NIJ Standard - 0101.06

by Office of Law Enforcement Standards, National Institute of Standards and Technology July 2008

You can download it in .pdf file from here:

Ballistic Resistance of Body Armor NIJ Standard - 0101.06 | National Institute of Justice

This standard supersedes NIJ 2005 Interim Requirements, Ballistic Resistance of Body Armor (August 2005), and also supersedes NIJ Standard-0101.04 Rev. A, Ballistic Resistance of Personal Body Armor (June 2001).
[2005 Interim standard was extablished to make sure vest contain no Zylon as although it's very strong it degrades very quickly, within 2 years usually.]

tazape

Halo61 you asked about the saab-Bofors (aka Bertil)9mm HP/M39B round it is being manufctured by Nammo. its bullet weighs 6.80 gram it has 106grains v/o is 480 m/s. Full steel jacket with a gilded metal coating. 65 layers of kevlar penetrated at 50 meters and 3mm mild steel at 75 meters. all the info i have on that one.