Why are Bouncers/Doormen not given stab vests ?

[valleyboy]

Hi Pablo

Whats being x army got to do with being a DS and being able to choose the right kit for the job.
Never heard the saying, Try before you buy!!.

[VICTORMACE]

Whats being in the army got to do with Door Supervision, someone please tell me. door supervisors dont in this country have an awful lot of tools available to them except reason, awareness, calmness first aid and the ability to handle the sh*t when it hits the fan. Please tell me where to get Kevlar armour for £100 and I'll get myself some !
I've looked into work i.e. plain black waterproof jackets with Kevlar sewed into it which costs anywhere up to £700 !!

[ExRegAndy]

If you dont wear a vest you might get stabbed and if you do wear a vest you might get to brave for your own good then get stabbed! One thing for sure though if you buy a vest from an un known source like lttle woman said you are just wearing and expensive body warmer that wouldt stop the rain!

[PabloGonzales]

Also if we talk abbout self defence, dont forget that, in order, to protect yours principal (I'm a CPO:~), but that can be extended to the club or pub as well ), YOU MUST BE ALIVE! So, in order to complete your mission you must use all the tricks you know. In special, USE YOUR COMMON SENSE! If that venue don't let you were a kind of vest just put that think under! Important is for you to stay safe. Sure, your common sense, 'll tell you to be dressed apropriate with the job. Don't you?

[PabloGonzales]

Yes,that's right but the think that army is good for, is that you'll know what's the difference between o ne think and the other. That'll save yours money. The shop I'm talking abbout is a army shop in Northampton. The vest is under1kg heavy and is comming in two colors black & white. What you have to do is just change the vest. For different threat I've got 16 layer kevlar vest where I add the plate who act as trauma plate. Light and cheap. Sure no vest can garantee you 100% protection...

[PabloGonzales]

If you 'll need more 'll be happy to send you some links. Good luck, & keep yourself out of truble! Pablo

[VICTORMACE]

Send me some links, or PM me with the name of the shop in Northampton.

[rupert]

In answer to the original question; from experiance; COST.

I set up my company just before the sia came on board; at the time all staff in our area were working for between £6-8 per hour, and their tax was left to them, either as self employed individuals or non atall.

Our intention was to employ these guys, by taking over existing held contracts and selling our company on its professionalism, hence being able to pay higher rates out of proportion with the area; rates we thought the DS deserved - £10.00 per hour AFTER tax, while all staff as a result of the SIA became PAYE, we were also able to offer other "perks" such as sick pay etc, unheard of with other companies in the area.

Our charge to the venue, left us with a "contribution" of £0.50p per man-hour, after costs - wage and PAYE/NI etc

Up front we bought company polo shirts, ties and pilot shirts, clickers, incident books and even radios for those venues where none existed. Due to sharing office premisis costs were kept to a minumum.

As a result we could not afford PPE such as stab vests for 50-60 staff, without increasing our costs to the client. Allready increased by £2-3 per man hour against those of competing companies; but due to our quality of staff and service this was acceptable, but a further greater increase for sure would not be.

As such at the time vests were not seen as being too important. Some staff did/had bought their own.

Our staff worked at venues including small private bars, town centre clubs, private functions etc, as well as having staff in larger venues subcontracted to the likes of 3D, Luminar and JD Wetherspoons; but the risk was seen as minimal, certanly weighed up against the cost.

Things have changed slightly in just a few short years, and there are certanly some venues we worked at were I would chose to wear a vest, if only for impact protection from glass.

But cost IS the driver. When you look at the set up of most DS companies, they "employ" large (dozzens) numbers of staff, on in essance a part time basis, with the owner either working as DS himself or earning just enough on top to not need to; they are not as a rule larger companies that can take the hit/investment of the overheads associated with buying multiple numbers of vests at £200 odd each.

Also, from my experiance I would be more inclined to invest £200 in a pair of clear lense Oakleys to protect my eyesight before I bought a stab vest.

[PabloGonzales]

hi victormance, give few days for links and hope to go on this week-end to talk with the lady own the shop. i just come back now, from a operation in spain and i've got few thinks to buy for myself too. i'll ask her to see if is got one. last time when i 've been shoping for a frend of mine i've got the last one. don't worry i'll help you to find one for yourself. i'll come back to you next week. thank for talking to you and keep in tuch. all the best to everyone! pablo gonzales

[littlesquirrel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by PabloGonzales The probs with somme doormans is that manny of them never been in the army. That's the reason whay they can't choice the right tools for the task they have got. Too heavy body armour for door, is useless. Did no one hered of kevlar plate? Is it light and can be used as trauma plate as well. Is cost only 100£ new .

I think you are dracstically missing the point, i worked in door security for over 13years, and i have no miltatry back ground, this didnt hinder me in choosing the correct protective gear for working at venues, door staff have a hard enough time, with the stigma of being thick, with out the comment you made slightly touching a nerve. Any door supervisor worth there salt will resurch, ask questions and gain the relevent information required to keep them as safe as possible while working, hopefully through there sia training, or heaven forbid common sence. Ok rant over, Squirrel out.