Belfort

No disrespect to any of the instructors or the course content, but you could find yourself in court for assault and unlawful detention, not to mention human rights act offences in criminal and/or civil court.

Also, as it has happened in the past, how you are going to defend yourself in court when someone has had a panic attack for being handcuffed and ended up in hospital?!

I'd rather prefer useing my mouth to keep them out than to end up in court wasting my time and explaining myself because of an idiot.

No, my friend, i don't live on the Land of giants as you mentioned.. it does take more than 2 most of times to restrain someone safely. Police sometimes struggle to perform it, as I witnessed so many times.

Basha72

Belfort,

I'm guessing that by your comments towards Restraints, that you have witnessed someone applying cuff's in a manner that may have looked a bit rough ?

Which has clouded your view on the use of them. The People that take the time to train in the correct ACPO application of cuff's will only use them in the very extreme case, as one of the other members posted, he has only used them 9 times I think it was in all the years he as been working. My Instructor had only used his in real life 8 times, he had always managed to talk them down or use other holds. the issues arise with people "some" that buy them and slap them on everyone they come across that looks funny at them. these are the people that should not have them.

Like I've said the people that have taken the time to see the correct use, words of command etc etc use of force forms and all that understand the Law.


I have a member of staff who actually cuffed an Off duty Police Officer who was a bit worse for wear one night in a club, he kicked of big time so he got cuffed, he later asked the lad after tellinf him who he was "who trained you, because that was a very well applied cuff's"


Views and opinions are exactly that views, so don't impose your view that they are not to be used ! They are a tool in the trade of keeping order in a civilised society ! and in the right trained hands are used to great effect.


Basha72

polarserv international

Even a 'drunk and coked up dickhead' can easily be restrained and long as the DS has confidence and is a proficient fighter. (and by this I do not mean some pumped up thug looking for a victim).

The correct use and application of a lateral carotid restraint is highly effective use of minimum force against any opponent.......no bruises, no blood, no broken bones or visual trauma and more importantly, no commotion. The shime-waza is most efficient against the larger and more aggressive opponent due to the increased metabolic rate leading to a state of temporary cerebral hypoxia.


And then cuff the idiot!!!!!!!!!!.......easy see.

hippy

Yes most of us would rather use our brain (not mouth, that sounds far to aggresive) to defuse situations, but anyone who is regularly involved in potentially volitile situations will tell you sometimes it is not going to be defused! It can always get physical! As for going t ocourt for assault and illegal detention.. Have you not actualy read some of the earlier comments? Many of them clearly state they have been to court sucessfully!!! The person cuffed has ended up with the custodial sentence.

Yes, you may get someone attempt a counter claim, or some cluess bobby not understanding the law and attempting to get you convicted, but as long as your training is in date (Andy Walkers APR for example.. Good training conducted by an EXCELLENT instructor) and you insurance is in order and you acted according to your instruction you will be fine...

Should a police officer not cuff for fear of possible comeback? Of course not, but these undesirables try to counter the police officer as well.. My cousin, a DCI (see we can all throw family into the argument) with GMP has over his 20 year career been accused of and investigated for many incidents, all due to some villian he has arrested tryin to 'muddy the water'... But as the always cuffed or restrained or 'subdued' in line with 'current guidelines' he has always walked away...

As for taking 2 people to restrain someone... No not always... I have regulary restrained and cuffed individuals alone. It requires training and practice.. And practise is where the police fall down... They dont re-train anywhere near enough to make the techniques 'hard wired' which is why when it all goes physical on the street many officers forget the training and it becomes a bundle.. I have been approached by my local Constabulary and asked to provide quotes for on-goin training for street level officers as the forces seniors have finally noticed the short falls

charlie taters

Polarserv, that Ibiza bouncer vid is class. I liked the round of applause as the DS returned to the stairs, calm, professional and just the touch of pure class as he placed the unconcious piss head in the recovery position.

See, he didn't need cuffs. But then why cuff an unconcious punter. Perhaps we should take a leaf from his book.....

Marcus2RRF

Cant wait to see comments on the marker spray course

polarserv international

Have only ever used the marker spray once and the effects were not impressive. It got the attackers attention for about 4 seconds and failed to stain the skin, probably due to the humidity factor................you just can't beat a quick shot of CS.

wingnut

There is alot of legislation flying around here in simple terms he it is.

I am a serving Military Policeman, and I have used both plasti cuffs and Quick cuffs and have used them in both calm and violent situations plasi cuffs cannot be applied to a violent subject by one person unless you are considerably stronger (to akward) also these are much harder to ajust should you apply them to tight.
Quick cuffs can be applied by one person, however I have on two seperate occasions broke two differents sets of theses on extremely violent subject, I have also had trouble getting them on strong individuals bith mil and civvy.

There is no law that says you cant carry cuffs and should the situation arise that a prolong attack from an individual then your justification is there even if you are a civvy security employee.
Bearing this in mind nearly every single occasion a set of cuffs is applied I have recived a complaint not down to the way I applyed them but simply because if a subject struggles they will cause tempory damage to there wrists, but this is minimal normally in the form of a mark or small amount of broken skin.
Personally I would say carry them if you are happy to give evidence in a court to your "honest held belief, that you could see no other solution to that problem. I cuff civvy that kick off for both my safety and there own, this is preferable to a baton or a strike.
I would no advokate DS using them on the streets of Manchester or London tho.

Taranis

APR Qualified trainer, so many people quick to shoot APR down, without knowing the full details of the course, accreditation, training and insurance.

We all carry the cuffs, overtly and covertly dependent upon client and venue/event. We have never had a problem with the Police, Courts or anybody else because we don't misuse them. We only use reasonable and justifiable force and use them in the exact way taught by the APR program, when affecting a citizens arrest. It is true a number of Police officers are unaware of the law relating to the cuffs and most are still worried about it until they see the full info, insurance and witness a course, then no problems and they are 100% behind it.

I fully recommend the use of the restraints and much prefer them to the alternative. Quickcuffs particularly cause tremendous damage, never had an injury off APR's KeyCuffs to date.

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Our Company has contracts in Static Guarding, Event Security, Close Protection, Surveillance and more. We never leave home without our cuffs.

dinger97

Hello mate i,m looking to do a course as soon as one come's about i live salisbury ,hope hear back soon with soome details cheers Dinger